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 Post subject: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:18 am 
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This is not new to some of you - but a good link to keep around for many reasons. Since I sell Phal violacea var alba acquired from Taiwan - it's probably a good reference to remind customers that it's hard to get a 'true'
Phal violacea v alba

http://www.toga.org.tw/eng/article.php?id=26

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The result, my Phalaenopsis Penang Violacea . I am in debt to Mrs. Regner from the Philippines who has so kindly gave me her only collected Phalaenopsis mitcholitzii. Bred with my Phalaenopsis violacea, I was successful the first time. Every seedlings bloomed pure white. The seedpod bred with Phalaenopsis violacea ‘super alba’ gave me enough seedlings. But the seedpod bred with Phalaenopsis bellina had only a few dozen seedlings.
Not satisfy with the results, I made Phalaenopsis Penang Jewel by crossing Phalaenopsis Penang Violacea with Phalaenopsis violacea ‘Super Alba’ again and the results were almost prefect. Now everybody can have a white “Phalaenopsis violacea’
Having done this, I have created a huge problem. Now there is always an albino Phalaenopsis bellina or a Phalaenopsis violacea exhibited in every show in Malaysia and Singapore. And it is actually quite difficult to tell the different between a Phalaenopsis Penang Jewel from an albino Phalaenopsis violacea and Phalaenopsis bellina.

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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 10:53 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:43 pm
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Location: Canyon Country, Ca
Thanks for posting this as a reminder Peter.

I actually think this may have implications beyond just violacea alba.

For instance the "micholitzii" that I used create my Pengang Violacea coerulea may itself be Penang Violacea and not a pure micholtzii. That plant is not breeding like it's a pure micholitzii. Both the color coming through and the form don't seem right. So I can't help but wonder if the cross I made was really Penang Violacea X violacea indigo.


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:05 pm 
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TxRobNLA wrote:
Thanks for posting this as a reminder Peter.


thx to me too! :D


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:28 am 
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Location: Orléans, FRANCE
Thanks Peter for this "mise au point". ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:18 am 
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Sad story in a way...."Phalaenopsis violacea of Malaysia never had a chance." :(

Is phal violacea extinct in the wild?


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:50 am 
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If you have time, this is an interesting reading from National Geogrphic that mentioned Michael Ooi as an internationally renowned orchid dealer.

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2010/01/asian-wildlife/christy-text/10

Pete - At the end of the day, you decide for yourself what to believe. Let's remind ourselves that this is a hobby. For anyone who makes this more than a hobby - well, it ceased to be fun and you get burned out. I don't lose sleep over what I was told is true or not. I love to hear everyone's opinion and stories. I will decide for myself what seems credible.

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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:08 am 
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Peter wrote:

"At the end of the day, you decide for yourself what to believe. Let's remind ourselves that this is a hobby. For anyone who makes this more than a hobby - well, it ceased to be fun and you get burned out. I don't lose sleep over what I was told is true or not. I love to hear everyone's opinion and stories. I will decide for myself what seems credible."

Exactly!


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:38 am 
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Peter, I hope you never get burned out.

Edited to add: Just started reading that NatGeo article - please excuse my language, but WTF? Using a zoo to traffic and kill the basically extinct tiger for parts?? And, the government is complicit in this? I think I am going to be sick.


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:25 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:43 pm
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Location: Canyon Country, Ca
Just to be clear, I have no issue with with Ooi or anyone else making primaries/near primaries to create specific forms like a white violacea like orchid. What drives me nuts is when the plants end up being mislabeled and then distributed. Obviously Ooi was not the one that did the mislabeling. I just wish the larger companies would be more careful and/or honest about it.

It hurts species conservation especially knowing we are loosing our native populations at an alarming rate. It hurts hybridizing efforts to be able to really understand what is going on in a set of crosses when the genetics/heritage of the parents you are using are in question.

It's very hard to not get frustrated when you put so much time and effort into a hybridizing program, especially when you don't have a lot spare time in the first place. ;-)


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:50 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2006 6:32 am
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Location: Norfolk, VA
For me part of the fun is figuring out whether a flower "keys" out to be a certain species, etc. Predicting what you get out of a specific cross is hard enough with "real" species, I can imagine how tough it gets when using parents of dubious parentage or when trying to work with specific varieties and forms.

Whether done purposefully or a complete honest mistake, we all know there are lot's of "species" floating out there that are not what they are labeled, not what we wanted them to be or worse - not what we paid (a lot) to have in our collection. It is what it is...

Most of these mysterys will remain mysterys... but there is some fun in the lore and the banter that comes from deciphering the mystery. To me that is a (fun) part of the hobby. So the next time I have a bellina alba, violacea alba and a Penang Violacea in bloom at the same time I will rush them to judging and let the fun begin.

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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:10 pm 
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"So the next time I have a bellina alba, violacea alba and a Penang Violacea in bloom at the same time I will rush them to judging and let the fun begin."

Trouble maker! I love it.


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 8:52 pm 
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Ooi mentions in the article (toga) that he collected blue violaceas from the jungle circa 1980. Were their blue violaceas prior to the Norton's Indigos?


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:02 pm 
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He said "having introduced" the indigo violacea in 1982. I am taking from that he is taking credit for the orginal flask that he gave the Norton's, and the Norton's through line breeding created the indigo violacea's. That is just my read.

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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:19 pm 
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I was referring to this statement from the toga article:

..." From my collection, I introduced my blue Phalaenopsis violacea seedlings in the early 1980’s."

Seems to be a pretty straight-forward statement to me.


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 Post subject: Re: Phal violacea v alba per Michael Ooi
PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:12 pm 
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There remains a huge difference in the original "blue" violacea plants available in the 80s and the "indigo" blue violacea forms that HP and Katherine produced and line bred with stock obtained from Michael Ooi. The plants the Norton's received from Michael were not coerulea forms but did contain some mutant genetics. Michael Ooi is not the person that introduced the "indigo" violacea plants but he did produce the original breeding line that led to them through the "magic" of the Nortons.
Dean

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